Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 21:55:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: Rolaant McKenzie
To: SDA
Subject: Re: EGW & the Shut Door


On Sat, 28 Jun 1997, SDA wrote:

> Rolaant,
> >
> > Actually, Mrs. White taught that the "door" of salvation, or "probation" as
> > she referred to it, had forever shut for the world in 1844.
>
> I discovered your statement to be misleading. She held that theory for a
> very brief period (probably less than a year) before she and others
> fully understood the sanctuary message. After her Feb. 1845 vision and
> much Bible study the Advent believers realized that the door of
> salvation was not shut.

Actually, the quotes I gave you from the EGW Estate website showed
clearly that EGW said she had a vision confirming the shut door, and then
some time later when it was shown to be false she denied ever having a
vision that confirmed it.

The point is that she was less than honest regarding her role in
confirming the Shut Door teaching.

In 1847 we have EGW with a vision confirming concerning the "shut
door." Later she indicated that disagreement with her on this matter
constituted the unpardonable sin.

On June 29, 1851, in Camden, New York, Ellen had another vision on the
shut door:

"Then I saw that Jesus prayed for his enemies, but that should
not cause us or lead us to pray for the wicked world, whom God has rejected
. . . our sympathy must be with Jesus, and must be withdrawn from the ungodly
. . . I saw that the wicked could not be benefited by our prayers now."

Also in 1851 Ellen White wrote:

"The Holy Ghost was poured upon us, and I was taken off in the
Spirit to the city of the Living God. Then I was shown that the
commandments of God, and the testimony of Jesus Christ relating to the
shut door could not be separated . . .

"My accompanying angel bade me look for the travail of soul for
sinners as used to be. I looked but could not see it; for the time of
their salvation is past."
Ellen G. White letter in Present Truth, 1, 3, pp. 22-23.

So the incontrovertible truth is that instead of holding this false
teaching for a brief period, and then setting the members
straight, Ellen White firmly held onto error for seven years. Later she
deliberately tried to claim otherwise.

And what about that very first vision that introduced the error, the one
that established her as a prophet? Robert Olson of the White Estate had
to admit, "Ellen misinterpreted the vision!"
One Hundred and One Questions on the Sanctuary and on Ellen White, p. 58.

How much confidence can we place on a professed prophet who seriously
misinterprets her very first vision?

> For a detailed analysis of the subject visit

SDA, your "detailed analysis" left out these important facts:

In his 1847 publication, "A Word to the Little Flock", James White
recounts this experience:

"WHEN SHE RECEIVED HER FIRST VISION, Dec. 1844, she and all the band
in Portland, Maine, [where her parents then resided] had given up
the midnight-cry, and shut door, as being in the past. IT WAS THEN THAT
THE LORD SHEW [sic] HER IN VISION, THE ERROR INTO WHICH SHE AND THE BAND IN
PORTLAND HAD FALLEN. She then related her vision to the band, and
about sixty confessed their error, and acknowledged their 7th month
experience to be the work of God"

A Word to the Little Flock, p. 22 (emphasis added)

On March 24, 1849 Mrs. White clearly states that her vision taught
her that the door of salvation was shut. She warns the faithful not to
allow their faith to be shaken in the shut door by the apparent
conversion of sinners since 1844.

"I was shown that the commandments of God and the testimony
of Jesus Christ, relating to the shut door, could not be separated....I saw
that the mysterious signs and wonders and false reformations would
increase and spread. The reformations that were shown me were not
reformations from error to truth, but from bad to worse, for those who
professed a change of heart had only wrapped about them a religious garb,
which covered up the iniquity of a wicked heart. Some appeared to
have been really converted, so as to deceive God's people, but if their
hearts could be seen they would appear as black as ever. My accompanying
angel bade me look for the travail of soul for sinners as used to be. I
looked, but could not see it, FOR THE TIME FOR THEIR SALVATION IS PAST"

Present Truth, pp. 21-22, August 1849 (emphasis added)

To make matters worse, EGW later denied ever having a vision conforming the
shut door.

"For a time after the disappointment in 1844, I did hold, in
common with the advent body, that the door of mercy was then forever
closed to the world. THIS POSITION WAS TAKEN BEFORE MY FIRST VISION was
given me. IT WAS THE LIGHT GIVEN ME OF GOD THAT CORRECTED OUR ERROR, and
enabled us to see the true position"

Selected Messages, vol. 1, p. 63 (emphasis added)

"With my brethren and sisters, after the time passed in forty-four
I did believe no more sinners would be converted. BUT I NEVER HAD A
VISION THAT NO MORE SINNERS WOULD BE CONVERTED. And am clear and free to
state no one has ever heard me say or has read from my pen statements
which will justify them in the charges they have made against me upon
this point"

Selected Messages, vol. 1, p. 74 (emphasis added)

If you are really interested in telling the truth, SDA, and not just
promoting EGW no matter what, you would include these passages into your
"detailed analysis".

May the Lord bless your study.
______________________________________________________________________________
Rolaant McKenzie

The conversation concluded after this post. SDA chose not to pursue this discussion further. It was clear in the conversation that SDA (and many Seventh-day Adventists for that matter) has a serious misunderstanding of what the gospel is and what it is not. This is due in large part to Ellen G. White's influence over Scripture. Even when evidence is presented from her writings where she contradicted the Bible (especially as a result of her "visions"), SDA, like many Adventists, seek to brush it aside, excuse it with other statements, or ignore it altogether. It is hoped that anyone reading this who is studying with Seventh-day Adventists or thinking of joining them will take heed and not become part of this church.